Which Ewing brother is older, Ray or Gary? A few other questions from a newbie fan...

[Unregistered]

I just got into DALLAS and KNOTS LANDING a little over a year ago after watching reruns on SoapNet, so I have a few questions regarding the Ewing brothers...

1.) Is this the correct order from oldest to youngest: J.R., Ray, Gary, and Bobby?

2.) Have Gary and Ray even held a conversation together?

3.) Which brothers had the best relationship with each other? In fact, how did each brother get along with Gary Ewing? Did Bobby and Ray ever become friends after Ray found out he was a Ewing? Better yet, did Ray stop taking orders from Bobby once he found out that Bobby was his little brother? I know that J.R. and Ray started off as friends until Ray found his fiance in bed with J.R. and the revelation that Ray was the bastard son of Jock Ewing. Speaking of which...

4.) What was the reaction of J.R., Bobby, and Gary upon finding out that Ray Krebbs was a Ewing? What was MRS. ELLIE'S reaction to finding out that Ray was Jock's son with another woman?

5.) How many guest-appearances did Ted Shackleford (as Gary Ewing) make on DALLAS? I know that the first time Gary came back to Dallas he was portrayed by another actor, and I recall that TS returned to Dallas for the reading of Jock's last Will and Testament.

...thanks for the help, peeps!

[HookEmHorns]

From what I know, the sequence of brothers goes like this: Ray, J.R., Gary, Bobby. I could be wrong, though. In the first season, it seems like Ray and Bobby get along pretty well, but I haven't seen any episodes past the DVD set, so I really can't answer your other questions. Hope you get the answers you need! Welcome to the forum!
--LN

[Nikie]

JR is the oldest, it either goes Ray then Gary or Gary then Ray...but I thinking it was Ray then Gary.

[HookEmHorns]

Really? I thought Jock fathered Ray before he and Miss Ellie were married? --LN

[Nikie]

Jock father Ray in the middle of the war with Margaret Krebbs while he was married to Miss Ellie.

[HookEmHorns]

Ohhhhh, bad Jock! . Thanks for setting the record straight for me. --LN

[Unregistered]

You learn something new everyday...

)

[CarlD]

Not sure who's older, Ray or Gary. Ray looks older to me, with his premature gray hair.

I think Jock told Ellie about the affair as soon as he got home, at least he has a conscience. Didn't find out Ray was his son until early season 3 though.

[Tatianna]

Not sure who's older, Ray or Gary. Ray looks older to me, with his premature gray hair.

I think Jock told Ellie about the affair as soon as he got home, at least he has a conscience. Didn't find out Ray was his son until early season 3 though.

Really, I didn't know that. I thought Jock only told Miss Ellie about the affair with Margaret after Amos Krebbs told Jock that Ray was his son. I never realized that Miss Ellie already knew about the affair.

[Nikie]

I didn't know the affair had been talk about it till after Ray found out that he was Jock's son.

[Kate Ewing]

I just watched this episode last night and this is what it tells us. Ray was born in 1945. We know this because Amos gives Jock Margaret's 1946 diary in which she talks about how Ray is one year old. Jock tells Amos that after he was married to Miss Ellie he went to England in the war, had the affair with the nurse (Margaret) and came home and fessed up. Of course he did not know he had fathered a son.

Now JR was born I believe in 1939. Miss Ellie and Jock were married I think in 1935. She tells Sue Ellen they had problems in their marriage til JR was born which was a few years later. I think there is some other corroboration that JR was born in 1939.

Bobby was born in 1952. We know this because Scotty Demarest tells the family that Bobby is the only one who couldn't have shot Hutch McKinney because he was being born at the time of the shooting, 28 years ago, which in 1980 would be 1952.

So Gary is somewhere between Bobby and JR and I am guessing he is younger than Ray because Jock was in the service in the early 40's. So Gary was born probably between 1946 (when Jock returns from the war) and 1952. I remember a conversation in the kitchen between Gary and Bobby where it seemed they were very close in age.

In answer to one of your other questions, Bobby and Gary were very close. JR had no use for Gary and thought he was a loser. Bobby and Ray were always like brothers even before they knew they were brothers. JR and Ray were good friends until the Garnet McGee incident and then it was never the same.

[MsTexas73]

HOt4JR, thanks for the posting. This is what I thought also, except I thought Gary was around the same age as Ray, maybe even a years older. But remembering that conversation in the kitchen, I can see Gary and Bobby being even closer in age. And it would make sense too, because it would justify even more JR's dislike of his brothers, especially if her were an only child for a while.

BUT on the other hand, I thought JR was still pretty young when Miss Ellie has Gary, because Jock takes over raising him when Gary is born.

[Kate Ewing]

I'm thinking JR was around 6 when Gary is born. This would explain his sense of entitlement. He had several years to be an only child and resented the addition of first one and then a second brother.

[Unregistered]

I just watched this episode last night and this is what it tells us. Ray was born in 1945. We know this because Amos gives Jock Margaret's 1946 diary in which she talks about how Ray is one year old. Jock tells Amos that after he was married to Miss Ellie he went to England in the war, had the affair with the nurse (Margaret) and came home and fessed up. Of course he did not know he had fathered a son.

Now JR was born I believe in 1939. Miss Ellie and Jock were married I think in 1935. She tells Sue Ellen they had problems in their marriage til JR was born which was a few years later. I think there is some other corroboration that JR was born in 1939.

Bobby was born in 1952. We know this because Scotty Demarest tells the family that Bobby is the only one who couldn't have shot Hutch McKinney because he was being born at the time of the shooting, 28 years ago, which in 1980 would be 1952.

So Gary is somewhere between Bobby and JR and I am guessing he is younger than Ray because Jock was in the service in the early 40's. So Gary was born probably between 1946 (when Jock returns from the war) and 1952. I remember a conversation in the kitchen between Gary and Bobby where it seemed they were very close in age.

In answer to one of your other questions, Bobby and Gary were very close. JR had no use for Gary and thought he was a loser. Bobby and Ray were always like brothers even before they knew they were brothers. JR and Ray were good friends until the Garnet McGee incident and then it was never the same.

Just one more question (for now LOL)...I remember the first time Gary came back to Southfork Bobby made a remark about being too young to understand the rift between J.R. and Gary and said that he did not know Gary all that well. Of course, Gary was run out of town by J.R., again, and Bobby commented on how he liked having another brother at Southfork because Gary was sincere and had a heart. Well, when did Gary and Bobby ever find the time to have a brotherly bond when Gary moved to Knots Landing, California? Was it ever acknowledged that Bobby and Pam went to vist Gary and Valene in Knots Landing?

Oh, and did Jock and Gary ever come to terms before Jock had passed away? Why was there so much friction between them in the first place? For that matter, why did J.R. hate Gary so much, yet he was always protective of Bobby (despite Bobby punching him out numerous times)?

[Kate Ewing]

Bobby did go to Calif to set up Gary and Valene in Knots Landing. Don't know if Jock and Gary came to terms before Jock's death, but I think so because Jock attended Gary's remarriage to Valene. There was friction because Gary did not have a head for business, and was, as Miss Ellie put it, "A Southworth among Ewings", was only into ranching and painting, and was not tough like JR. JR did not really hate his brother, he just had no respect for him because he was so different. Nevertheless JR seemed to always feel he had to keep Gary away or else it would threaten his position in the family. That's my take.

[Mrs.JockEwing]

I believe J.R. was born in 1939, Gary 1943, (because Lucy was born in 1961), Ray 1945-1946, and Bobby 1949. In Pam's dream Bobby's birthdate is 1949.

[MsTexas73]

Mrs. Jock that sounds pretty accurate. Bobby was supposed to be around ten years younger than JR. And I think I've seen those dates pop up before. I think it was a writers' error with that 1952 business, as he and Donna are supposed to pretty close be the same age, and in 1978/79 Donna was 28 (I honestly still can't believe they made her that young) She looked older than Sue Ellen.

Anyway, That's my take on things.

[FifthBrother]

To answer another question: Gary and Ray did have several conversations together... One when Gary first came back to the ranch in the first season, another when Gary came back for Bobby's funeral in season eight, maybe a few other brief talks here and there. But there was no brotherly bond, as they didn't grow up together. They were friendly acquaintances mainly.

[Tatianna]

That's how I remember it also, Fifthbrother. JR and Bobby saw Ray on a daily basis and their bond was what you might expect, given the circumstances, but Gary never had the opportunity to get to know Ray and bond as brothers since he lived in California. I never recalled it mentioned on Knots Landing about Ray being a Ewing.

I believe it was easier for JR and Bobby to accept Ray since they had liked him before the relationship was exposed. If they had not known Ray before, I don't think they would have been as accepting of him.

[Unregistered]

I just find the Ewing sibs relationships with each other to be quite interesting, especially with Gary Ewing being so far removed from the family. A few more questions, and then I will leave everybody alone...

)

1.) Did Lucy Ewing ever reconcile with Gary and Valene in Knots Landing? In fact, whatever happened to Lucy into the last season of the show?

2.) Between J.R. and Bobby, which brother was better, or more successful, as the CEO of Ewing Oil? I know J.R. pretty much ran the show in the beginning, but I read that Bobby came out as the victor in the war he had with J.R. over control of Ewing oil. Did J.R. ever get back Ewing Oil?

3.) I had heard that Mrs. Ellie left Southfork Ranch to Bobby when she left Dallas with Clayton Farlow (that his name?)...why didn't she leave it to J.R.? Where did Mrs. Ellie and Clayton run off to?

4.) I had also learned that J.R. discovered that he had a son prior to the one he had with Sue Ellen, and that his son was a grown man when he reunited with J.R....who was the mother of J.R.'s eldest son? Was she ever on the show at some point?