View Full Version : Lucy's abortion: Was it right or wrong?
05-28-2000, 07:23 PM
I know that this is a very controversial subject, but I thought that it could be really explored on the forum. Lucy was raped by Roger, and became pregnant. Roger, as we all know, was a nut-case stalker. Lucy ultimately decided to abort the baby.
Do you think that she was right to have the abortion??
Personally, I think that she was well supported in her reasons to abort the baby. She was very young, and had her whole life infront of her. It wasn't as if she had conceived the baby out of her own decsion. She was raped.
I am pro-choice. I know that a lot people think that abortion is sinful, but I believe that abortion should be used, not as a method of birth control, but as a last minute resort for those like Lucy who needed it.
What do y'all think?? Do people feel that it was right Lucy aborted the child or should she have kept it?
05-28-2000, 07:29 PM
Well I think they handed the whole abortion thing VERY badly.
Anyway your asking about abortion, well to be honest I am aganist it really. In my mind a baby would be born and despite what happens is it right to kill a life or potential life. I don`t think I could do it but then again if it was due to rape I could again say no I would keep it but in real terms it is down to that individual to decide and how they feel.
You always surprise me Pam :-). I figured you as pro abortion all the way. In any case, I'm not a fan of it myself, but I feel the individual involved should have the final choice.
An interesting senario however, if a woman wanted the abortion and the father did not, should he have any legal say in the matter?
Any thoughts? :-)
05-29-2000, 08:03 AM
I myself am pro choice. It's a very tough and agonizong decision any woman has to make. Could I or Lucy look at that baby and love it knowing how it was concieved? I don't know, I just don't know. Lucy could of given up the baby for adoption but who's to say that down the road guilt would likely consume her? All in all I think she did make the right choice. Pam contemplated abortion also and clever of the writers to have Pam by Lucy's side as she went through it. Remember the look on Pam's face when she stood outside Lucy's hospital room. I for one was glad that Pam didn't critisize Lucy for her decision.
05-29-2000, 12:07 PM
See I think that Lucy took all of that into consideration. You know like, could she look at this baby and truly love it the way it was conceived. I'm sure that there are cases where mothers have decided to keep the child and love it, but I think that Lucy wouldn't have been able to do this. I mean think about it, you have your whole life ahead of you, and now your pregnants, and it you had no control in how the baby was conceibed. That's why abortions that are caused by rape is such a controversial topic. I wonder how Roger would have taken the abortion though, now that you say that Jock. Does anyone know if legally he had a claim to that child. Personally and morally, I don't believe he did have a claim. Only because under the pretences that the child was conceived.
I think that the show should have better portrayed Lucy after the abortion and rape. You know being more cautious and having repressed memories about what she had done, because I'm sure that women that deal with situations like this have these problems too. I think, overall, that the main descion came down to Lucy, but the writers should have wrote it so her family would be there to support her. I bet Miss Ellie's motherly attachments that she has with Lucy would have really came through.
On a side note, do you think JR would have been suportive of the abortion?
I am pro-life, which means I believe in a consistent ethic of life. I do not believe in abortion, nor euthanasia, nor captial punishment.
I believe that killing of any kind is wrong, whether it be inside or outside of the womb. I do understand many reasons for abortion. But in every case I believe adoption to be the better alternative.
How could you look at the baby and love it knowing how it came to be? You don't have to but there is someone who will! So many people want to adopt and have trouble doing so. There will always be someone wanting your child. Also though, I don't understand (and maybe it's because I'm not a woman) how a woman could look at her child and wonder if she could love it or not. Half of it is you. When you abort it, you kill the half that is you too.
When it comes to paternal rights, I believe there should be some. In the case of rape, I don't believe the "father" has any rights. In the case of a relationship, the father definitely has rights. TWO people made the decision to have sex so TWO people need to make the decision about the baby.
"I'll see you at the office, partner." (Pam to JR in dream season Oil Baron's Ball)
05-31-2000, 09:58 AM
SUCH a CONTROVERSIAL topic! I'm pleased to see so far that everyone has expressed their opinions in an intelligent manner and it's been a civilized discussion. Let's keep it that way.
Politically, I am Pro-choice. I feel that if men could get pregnant, they would experience some of the agonizing situations women who have been pregnant are in, and how difficult the decision to abort or keep a child or give it up for adoption is for women. If men could get pregnant, I believe that the right to abortion would be written into an amendment to the constitution.
However, men can't get pregnant, and unfortunately, traditionally, many men have abandoned women they impregnated, or subsequently abandoned their children. Also, traditionally women have been the primary caregivers of children. As such, the responsibility of raising and supporting an unplanned or unwanted child has typically fallen to the woman. It is because of this situation that I feel every woman has a right to an abortion if she chooses, because ultimately SHE is the one who will be responsible for the child. Even when a father is involved and pays child support, the mother bears most of the responsibility.
As for whether fathers have a right to prevent a woman from having an abortion, it is the woman who will be pregnant for nine months, it is the woman whose body will be forever changed, and it is the woman who will forge an emotional bond with the child, even if she does give it up for adoption. If it weren't for these and other considerations, then I would say that fathers should have equal say in whether a child is created.
Under no circumstances should a woman who has been raped be forced to have a child. Rape is a traumatic, violent experience for a woman, and to make her suffer through months of pregnancy, remembering that rape, is barbaric, especially so because she did not conceive the child through any fault of her own. That would be like forcing a man who had been robbed and beaten to be robbed and beaten again.
Now that I've given my political views, and the reasons for which I firmly support abortion, I'll give my personal views. I hope and pray that I NEVER have to get an abortion, because it would be a traumatic decision for me. I feel that abortion is too easy in this country, and that because of that, people act irresponsibly and women get pregnant too frequently, knowing that abortion is available. Personally I am always careful and can't understand women who aren't. I feel that you should not sleep with someone you wouldn't want to father your child, you shouldn't be careless about birth control, and you shouldn't take chances unless you would be able to raise a child that results from those chances.
However, I can't predict the future, and I am not the one to decide for other woman what to do with their bodies, and I want abortion to be there for me if I ever did need it. That's why I support abortion although I would not want to have an abortion myself.
Lucy's decision to abort a child conceived from a rape was right for her. It would take an extraordinary woman to carry the reminder of her rape then give it up for adoption.
One question I have always pondered, and I might anger the pro-lifers out there, but I need to ask it: If pro-lifers' beliefs are so strong, instead of expending so much effort trying to prevent women from having abortions, why don't they help poor women who have had children to support and take care of those children? Many women have abortions because they don't have enough money or family support to take care of the children, yet pro-lifers only seem to offer two choices: 1.abortion(evil to them) 2. adoption. Pro-lifers should offer financial support and child care to pregnant women for the life of the child. If pro-lifers took pregnant women into their homes or babysat for single or poor mothers' children, then I would belive that they are truly pro-life.
Pam Ewing, you make very good points. In regards to your last one about financial support, I know for a fact that there are many Catholic centers that do offer financial support for single/expectant mothers. And if they can't, they can refer them to a place that can. That was a good point to bring up because some pro-lifers seem to only be concerned with stopping the unborn baby from being aborted. As I said in my previous post, I believe in a consistent ethic of life which means I am basically "all life all the time". That's why I know of such centers.
As for Lucy and her abortion, I never really liked how they handled the storyline. Lucy rarely had good storylines. And when she had them it seemed really like it was just so her character could do something. She had this happen or that happen. Isolated incidences for the most part that weren't related at all. Whereas other characters had battles and storylines that related and were brought up. (For example, Pamela wanting to save her marriage while wanting to help her brother with the drill bit while at the same time having feelings for Mark. These were all related while Lucy's storylines usually weren't.) I think that the topic of abortion was only brought up so it could be brought up. I think it could have been a fascinating topic to explore on Dallas but I don't think it was handled well. I always thought Lucy should have kept the baby. For one, it would have kept the storyline of her rape up front and we could see how it was dealt with for more than a few episodes. Two, it is not what would be expected which would have worked perfectly during this era of Dallas back when it was daring and smart. Three, she would have matured quicker and maybe would have had more storylines. Four, can you just imagine how JR would take this?? That alone would be priceless. But, we can't go back in time and change things unfortunately.
"I'll see you at the office, partner." (Pam to JR in dream season Oil Baron's Ball)
Pam's Twin Sister
08-22-2001, 03:57 AM
Be realistic folks!
Lucy´s pregnancy was out of a limbo. We all saw that she and Roger were having an affair. Then Charlene Tilton got pregnant in real life and the producers wanted to lauch the question: What should Lucy do, have the baby or an abortion? I think there never was any doubt.
This was such a nonsense plot like Maggie´s pregnancy on Falcon Crest. There was no rape! Maybe out of scene? But onscreen, Roger just slapped on her face. Although, I think the subject was interesting and Lucy needes anything interesting.
08-22-2001, 05:43 AM
I often questioned the actual event of the rape. I know that television back in the late 70's early 80's didn't show a lot of controversial scenes on t.v. Dallas brought forth a lot of controversial things that no other soap at that time did. I remembered back when Lucy was kidnapped by Roger and that he held her hostage at his apartment/studio. In the scenes that followed the only time I saw Roger with Lucy was when he roughed her up a few times. All you saw was Lucy tired looking and withdrawn sitting in the chair all tied up. So, the rape is questionable to me.
I do know that they were physical a few times (both consently I might add). So, when Lucy said that Roger raped her, I'm not so sure that it really happened. Perhaps the producers didn't actually want to show that scene because of the controversy that would follow. I think that Lucy just said that so deep down inside she could think of a good excuse about having her abortion.
I think that because of her earlier relationship with Roger (getting even with Mitch) and then when he kidnapped her she was totally turned off and upset. I just question if the rape actually took place.
I am also pro-choice in my feelings for abortion, so whatever a woman decides to do with her body is her decision. Jock, you have a good question about the father's rights on an abortion. That is a hard question to answer. http://www.soapchat.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif
08-22-2001, 08:09 AM
...that a baby is not just a *part* of a woman's body? It's not like the woman's growing a new arm or leg that she wants removed...it's a life growing inside her. For that reason, I don't see how many pregnant mothers can say "it's my body, it's my choice." To my knowledge, women don't produce sperm and need a man as an equal partner...he may not have to carry the baby, but was that our decision? It's not like a couple drew straws and the woman lost, it's just nature that the woman carries the baby!
What if the man wants the baby to be born? It may be unfair to make the woman carry a baby she doesn't want (in fact, this is a VERY sticky issue), but the simple fact is- be careful, or DON'T have sex if you can't face the consequences of having a baby!
This goes for both men and women, but of course it's easier for the man to "Escape" should a pregnancy occur.
It's one thing to abort in cases of rape (which, I'm sorry, Lucy wasn't), incest, or other extrenuating circumstances, but to use abortion as birth control is wrong (in my opinion).
And to Mike's mention of being against euthanasia, I have a totally opposite opinion on that. Have you ever had a very sick relative, Mike? Why should someone be meant to suffer through a debilitating disease when there is little to no hope of them ever getting better? Life isn't life unless you LIVE.
"If I don't see your tail headin' out of here right now - and fast - I'm gonna blow it off. Now get out...get out!"
08-22-2001, 03:56 PM
I find this is far too personal a subject to debate on a forum like this. People's stances on abortion is rooted in their religious beliefs and convictions, something I regard as being a very personal subject.
Whether it was right or wrong is up to each person to decide for themselves, not for others to say or by laws to direct. However, it was an interesting and historic part of the show and I think Charlene Tilton did a commendable job with this story.
"I'm as pure as the driven slush..."
08-23-2001, 07:50 AM
I like to think that some day if a woman has an unwanted pregnancy that science will be so far advanced that the fetus could be safely taken from the woman and put into something that would care for it and allow it to grow into a healthy baby. I guess that sounds more like Star Trek than Dallas.
I've never had an abortion, but I have experienced the pain of a miscarriage. I will learn to deal with it, but the scars will never heal. http://www.soapchat.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif
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